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television providers, giving you a front row seat to democracy. host: aswad thomas is at our table this morning. he's the vice president of alliance for safety and justice, the national director of the crime survivors for safety and justice as well. we want to talk about resources for survivors of crime. this is personal for you. tell us your story. guest: thank you so much for having me on. back in 2009, i had just became the first men in my family to graduate college. i was on my way to play professional overseas, but unfortunately, i became a victim of gun violence in harford, connecticut. i was shot twice and my back and those bullets ended my professional basketball career and nearly my life. like so many victims from the hospital back into the same community where the incident happened with no support, no

services, no resourceses to recover from. that incident was changed my life like crime does with so many people with crime. host: what were you doing at the time of this and what were you doing in that community at that time? guest: just leaving the corner store in my neighborhood. just weeks before i was supposed to go overseas to play professional basketball and that incident, my doctors told me about the physical challenges that i would have but nobody ever mentioned the psychological effect of being a victim or dealing with the ptsd, you know, the anxiety, the stress, the nightmares of that incident. but like so many victims, law enforcement came to visit me several times during that recovery process. but each time that they visited me, it was always about the case. they never asked me how i was

doing. they never told me about any victim services that my family could seek out and get support. and they never even told me a victim advocate in their department that were supposed to work with victims like myself and my family were left to deal with that incident on our own. and that started this new journey of working with crime victims across the country. host: what resources were you looking for at the time? guest: like many crime victims, access to things like mental health. i was shot just blocks away from where i lived at. i would have loved to be able to get housing and relocation support to help me move away from that neighborhood, that traumatized myself and my family as well. in addition to that, every state having victim compensation program that pays for expenses like mental health, counseling, to help with the housing relocation support, but i was never made aware of none of those services, which is the experience of thousands of crime

victims across the country of not getting the support, even the person that shot me was also a victim of gun violence four years before i got shot and the doctor that saved my life saved his life as well. just like me, he was released from that same hospital back into that same community but with no support and i strongly feel like his unaddressed trauma played a huge role in my shooting years later. host: what evidence do you have that these resources are needed and on what scale? guest: i travel across the country and meeting with victims, fans with loved ones, and meeting victims with domestic violence and sexual assault, crime across the country, especially in communities that are most harmed by violence. those communities and those individuals are least supported by the justice system, are least supported by system.

so many organizations that are doing incredible work helping victims navigate the justice system, helping to provide grief counseling and support. so many of those organizations don't have the resources that's needed to help support crime victims. so our organization works to organize and train those survivors and organizations to be advocates to invest in more resources. host: why don't they have the resources? guest: when they look at crime and violence in this country, especially in communities of color that are most impacted by violence, we have been disrespected and disregarded for decades. the way that crime policy has been designed in this country, it doesn't protect the people who are most harmed by violence, and the resources that has been coming into communities for decades don't actually go to people that need it the most. so there are racial disparage

that exists in victim services and who actually gets help or not. host: why aren't they getting the resources? guest: so many policy barriers that exists. for example, the victim compensation program, every state have a victim compensation program to help pay for things like funeral and burial expenses and to when the housing relocation that i mentioned, to help change the door locks. every sedate has that program and it is known as the last resort. if you don't have any resources to cover a funeral for your loved one who lost their life to violence, last program that exists to help people but the challenging with that is that we did a survey of thousands of crime victims across the country and over 96% of victims did not access the victim compensation program. so most people don't know about it.

in order to be eligible, in some state, you have to file a police report within 48 hours or 72 hours after becoming a victim of a crime. if you meet that threshold, in some states you only have a year or two to apply for the program. those are barriers that exists in policies. if you or a loved one is on probation or if you owe fines or fees, you're not eligible to access the victim compensation program and there are policies and barriers where law enforcement deem that you contribute to your own victim accusation. so you're not able to get access to compensation. so those are some of the barriers that exists. most will not be able to access the program because of policy barriers. host: you were in the hospital

-- there was a 48-hour policy in your case. you were in the hospital for how long? guest: i was in the hospital for a week. and i didn't know about the victim compensation program until 10 years after i became a victim of a violent crime when i joined my organization. but i come from a family of victims. my father was shot and my older brother was shot and i have two cousins that were shot. and we all plenty of interactions with the justice. , but none that led to any help or services for us to deal with those experiences of being victims. host: we want our callers to join in. we want to hear your story or

chime in. remember all of you can text us, include your first name, city and state to 202-748-8003. so these policies, are they drafted on a city, county, state or federal level? guest: every state is unique. every state is different. for example, in the state of michigan, we passed a law just last year to extend the time limit for victims to file for the program in places like florida, we've passed the law back in 2019 to remove some of those policy barriers. so at the federal level, there are guidance, but each -- guidelines but each state is different. so that's why i've dedicated my life to working with crime victims, training them to understand. to remove those barriers and increase access to victim compensation. host: how are your groups funded?

guest: we are nonprofit organization. we get funded from foundations. we don't receive any government funding. we are grassroots organization. we have chapters of crime survivors which is our national network of victims of crimes. host: tell us about, you mentioned this but your 2022 survivor speak report survey that you did. what did you find out? guest: yeah, in that report -- so we actually did this report back in 2016. it was the first time there was a survey that actually asks victims what were their views on safety injustice? in 2022, we did that very similar report again as well. there's a few key findings that we find just from talking with crime victims on safety injustice.

most prefer a justice system that focus on rehabilitation and shorter prison sentences rather than long sentences. the majority of crimes victims prefer that a justice system focus more on things like prevention, like community supervision rather than locking people up for a long time but we also found out that the justice system isn't helping crime victims. host: there is a victims of crime act. it was passed by congress in 1984 and amended in 1988, established the office for victims of crime which is charged by congress with administering the crime victims fund that you've been talking about. the crime victims provides assistance and compensation program that offers support for those affected by violent crime.

the crime victims fund balance is over $1.2 billion. is that monegeing allocated? guest: that one, you know, that money, there's not a lot of resources for crime victims. so when i joined my organization back in 2015, the crime victims fund has increased from $745 million to about $2.3 be. so the cap had quadrupled in revenue to support crime victims over the past few years, the revenue and the cap have been decreasing every year. so currently, we are in a current crisis when it comes to supporting crime victims and many organizations across the countries are having to shut their doors, having to decrease services because of the decrease the crime victims fund.

host: we have a caller from new jersey. welcome to the conversation. go ahead. caller: thank you so much for having me this morning. first off, mr. thomas, i applaud you for your work. i do the same work here in north new jersey. and one thing i would love to just point out is that the victims -- the survivors of crime, those police that persecute those crimes, they are hardly ever held accountable. i deal with case after case where cops commit the horrific crimes and there's reposition of it basically other cities that's surrounding other areas, mr. thomas. second, this reaches a lot of survivors of crime, they do not get basic housing from skills, so just the support that they get from crimes. there are so many lack of resources that we do not have in our community. so applaud the work that you do and i apologize for you becoming a survivor of crime and anything that we can do in support your

mission, we're always there for you, brother, and thank you and have a good day. guest: thank you. and newark is doing incredible work as well. host: alicia, columbia, maryland, a survivor. alicia. caller: hello, greta. i think i'm calling on the wrong line. host: oh, ok. caller: forgive me. i'm so sorry about your situation that -- to happen to you. i'm so sorry. i'm native-american and we need help we are in a situation where we do not allow our officials to prosecute outside of our reservation. they rape our women, they do the same with our girls and now, the

illegals are coming into one of the reservations that i have heard last week into montana. and they are bringing drugs and since the reservation is large, they don't have enough police to patrol, you know, and those drug dealers are very smart. they call the police and say oh, we need help over here. and the police go there and of course, they do their dirty job elsewhere. so, what the supreme court and all the officials from washington have to do is get this done. give us the authority to prosecute those who do awful

stuff to us and we've been begging for this and there were two -- i'm sorry, i'm getting so loud -- host: it's so loud. alicia, we understand. guest: yeah, and thank you for sharing that. and we do need to invest more in, you know, in policies. we need to invest more holding people accountable. accountability and healing and prevention is key into these issues. so we actually can, you know, provide the resources to invest in more from violent crime which is what we are hearing from native communities and communities of color instead of spending so much resources and incarcerating people for non-violent crimes as well. host: tom from indiana. hi, tom. are you a survivor? caller: yes, i am. host: ok. would you care to share your story? caller: sure, i'll share it it's kind of related. i really think it is.

i'm going to try to make it fast. several years ago, a person broke into my garage, stole a bicycle and a bunch of meat on my refrigerate. aswad, i apologize. i know your case is a lot more serious than this. but it's kind of related. the perpetrators or the thief broke into the house, stole my things. they arrested him. so the police did a very good job of catching him. i had a bicycle that was stolen. so they called me in to press charges. i had no idea who the thief was. so they told me and unbeknowing to me, he was arrested with a kid. well, i was a teacher. i had the kid in my classroom. and i went to -- it says god, you can't put us in this position. so the other victim is the

child. so i took it upon myself to not press charges but i wanted an alternative said to let him go. he stole my bicycle, but let's see if we can find an alternative. so they did send me to victim person. but the prosecutor assistant took me into a courtroom with a lot of judge and people sitting in a jury. said look at this guy. he's going to drop charges for this thief and i said oh, i'm not talking to you at that time. i got pretty disrupted with him. went back, went to the main prosecutor. i said certainly you guys could do something. well, they sent me to the victim advocate. i told the victim advocate, i said let's be creative here. i got this kid in school. he can hardly read.

this father is not -- doesn't have a job. let's give him some community service with this kid. send him to the y or bring him to my school and in the hallway, he could tutor for his kids for two or three days a week which is a lot better than going to jail. host: ok, tom, i'm going to have aswad thomas jump in. thank you. caller: and thank you so much for sharing your story. trauma imall of -- trauma impacts all of us. we prefer different alternatives rather than just locking people up. it is the important work that our organization is doing across

the country. and what justice looks like. so it is our goals, our alternatives to incarceration. host: robert in connecticut. robert? caller: yes. i guess i want to ask him some questions. will he give me some personal information about -- he said he's from connecticut. is he -- i believe he said he's from harford, connecticut. so, i wanted to ask him questions about that. host: and what about it, robert? caller: ok. ok. i just want to get right to my point without being disrespectful to him. i used to run there because i was a drug addict all through hartford. i guess my question is he's a college graduate. he comes home. the question would be does he have a car? and he must know the areas that he shouldn't be going to.

so, i don't want to put it on him. he probably was an innocent guy. he got shot. i want him to know if he had enough sense not to go down that corner store. guest: thank you for asking that question. yes, i am from hartford, connecticut. i grew up from the same street where i got shot at. a community that has been devastated by poverty and devastated by a lack of education opportunity and lack of job. the community has been riddled by crime and violence for decades. one thing that i haven't seen in that community growing up and including when i got shot is i invested in things that actually keep communities safe. invested in programs, invested in helping people get back to work. but most importantly, invested in things that help people heal and recover from violence. and those are the things that a

community like hartford and so many communities across the country need in well-being which stops the violence and helping people get back to work and also get housing as well. host: i don't know if you asked this question but maybe you can say do people have a choice about where they are at that time? where they're living in these communities? guest: you know, i was shot in the community that i grew up. i love my community. and my story is not unique. there are so many crime victims of gun violence and domestic violence and sexual assault. for years, we invested billions of dollars into the justice system. billions of incarceration but we're not safer.

what if we were to take a dollar on -- and reverse that and invest more into communities? invest more in schools, invest more in programs? we can, you know, prevent a lot of crime from happening but unfortunately, our priorities are wrong in this country. we're not invested in communities but instead, we're invested in a justice system that doesn't keep us safe. host: a question from david. i was a crime victim twice my life. guest: every state has a victim compensation program. you can go to the website to look up where you can get counseling and support through the victim compensation program.

and so many victims like myself, i had thoughts of retaliation. that is often a natural response when you have been harmed. but the things that changed my life, that teenager was a victim of gun violence at 14 years old. and as a result, he lost sight in his left eye. and just like me, he reached back into that same community with no support. and i strongly believe his unaddressed trauma played a huge role in my incident years later. that leads the victimization to incarceration pipeline.

host: they have been a victim themselves. is that true? >> nine of 10 have been a victim of violent crime long before they came in contact with the justice system and they were not recognized as victim then and that trauma caused people to lash out, often cause people to become victims again or become in contact with the justice which we see far too often. host: danielle? caller: yes. host: good morning to you. caller: good morning. so, i just wanted to put a little bit of my story out there. in 2018, my house was broken into and i was pretty much almost killed. the person who did it, they were arrested for attempted murder/homicide, premeditated. now, i have thought and thought and thought for years in the

court -- fought and fought and fought in the court system. the minimum was 15-20 years the experience i had was absolutely horrible. the state prosecutor basically had me, you know, say they were tired of dealing with the case. the person who had done this to me had basically, revolves around attorneys and lawyers and all that other stuff going through. i guess he knew every loophole in the book to go for just to drag this out and drag this out and drag this out. and basically, he only got 12 years. now, the damages that i have from that, i mean, i had the back of my head split open. i spent six months with no memory. and it's people like me who are scared of those people getting out because even though he did get put in jail and was incarcerated, there was threat letters coming to my home. he had actually had people come out and he was charged with this

as well but no added time, took the lug nuts off my vehicle. thank god i wasn't driving my vehicle when it happened but i lost my tires. you had people like me who are terrified when that due date comes for them to come out of that jail. and there's nothing left for me to do about it, you know? i mean, he had a conflict of interest with the attorney because he claims he was a satanist. and now, i have three children. and so, at this point in time, like it's a literal fear of this person coming out and coming back to find me. and i don't know what else there is to do, you know? so some of these people that have done things like this, i do believe should be basically put away as long as you possibly can. i've gone to the point of even thinking that i need to change my last name.

host: ok. danielle's story there. aswad thomas. guest: and thank you for sharing, danielle. and this experience of so many crime victims that haven't found justice in our criminal justice system and justice should be rooted in accountability and in healing. when you are a victim of a crime as i experienced as danielle just mentioned, these are long-term affects that you have to deal with every single day. the mental health challenges that we experience were also just a spear as well. for most crime victims, there are two things that we want the most. we want what happened to us to never happen again and we want what happened to us to never happen to someone else. so we do need to hold people up accountable. we also need to help crime victims like myself and danielle heal and recover and that's where we need to invest our resource in helping crime

victims get back to the safety and support that they need. host: aswad thomas, why are you in washington, d.c.? guest: i'm here in washington, d.c. as i mentioned, the offices victims of crimes is doing incredible work and supporting a lot of states and helping organizations in crime victims access services. so i'm here in d.c. tomorrow as part of national crime victims rights. i will be receiving a award as a 2024 survivor for the work that i've been doing across the country and the work that my organization has been doing alliance for safety and justice this past decade. it's great to be in washington, d.c. to celebrate crime victims week and to be acknowledged for the work that i've been doing this past decade of my life, which is to help crime victims like me across the country get access and the support that they

need. host: thank you to coming to the "washington journal" and being a part of the conversation this morning. guest: thank you so much for having me. host: aswad thomas is the vice president for alliance for safety and justice and the director of the crime

at t trade union conference andeceived the official endorsement.