he puts himself, we're getting people to protest, connect with our community and tap into conversations you weren't find elsewhere. why is our government taking us to work on the basis of live? we the public have to get out there and do something about it. the stream on al jazeera, the hello on the bulk of this discount, and the cost of that, which is here in a week. so you look at the world of business and economics this week. calling university funding into question, protest is mainly in the us to mon, that schools divest them israel. so that's one, gaza. so how do they make them money? who should rebuild ukraine? us moves to make russia pay for its invasion. must go, threatens to retaliation. billions of it states assets of confiscate, sell, take,

talk or face upon the us is cracking down on the opposite chinese own a bi done. so how will it and millions of american businesses be affected the now from columbia university in new york to the university of southern california in los angeles, protests against israel as war on gaza spread across major american colleges, protest system ons, very in scope from school to school, but there is one common message disclose and divest students one that universities to be more transparent about web schools. bonnie is going to bomb these institutions, abandon a range of investments and companies. they say i can place it in genocide, so does divestment work. we'll discuss that with our guest shortly. the 1st one will consume sherry for reports but that's becoming a major colleges in the united states. students from campuses in the

east coast to the west have united their voice against east roseville on goal. so that's given nearly 35000 palestinians since october, columbia university, new york. the process began move in 2 weeks ago. fairly close for does this come from miss right? beside the school has an endowment fund, meeting certain $1000000000.00. protest has won't be institution to separate ties with companies linked to that this red folder, profiting from it will also include to johns like google and microsoft defense companies like lockheed martin, an investment from black crow among others. this is not a matter of simply by, you know, you think universities, this is a movement, an anti war movement. the university has so far, refused to divest from each well with full foot to make investments in health and

education. in casa students, reacted by taking over to campus building the police were called in to pay a demonstration suspect to separate colleges in the us with some nicole's to disclose inside this at hubbard the which is you invest in the us, but then endowment fund of more than $50000000000.00 for testing students wanted to reinvest resources in palestine and academy initiatives, communities, and culture. and at university of southern california. they've called for the school to ended study abroad programs. and this comes with the students and several teachers have been arrested across the country. the pretest to see the stuff that is the real state filings go to show that our universities are staring.

and that is why the over reacting with violence because they know the students have the power they know their students across the country are united for j investment from campuses in the us for pets have spread to separately colleges in for some months now. cloven marsden stations had been calling for a ceasefire from the st. the town. so it couldn't campuses the would over, with close to divest from each run and the consumption on to see the company. so how do you ever cease make their money? well, they rely on the tax exempt donation is the run into billions of dollars to funds, things like scholarships, research, and even stuff salaries. the national association of college and university business offices. so it's at least $700.00 institutions. hold nearly 840000000000 and endowment assets, colleges and universities invest this money across financial markets and stokes

hedge funds, businesses and real estate, protesting students, one that universities to withdraw or divest their endowments from his rated companies and businesses to profit from israel as well, on gaza, they want the money to be reallocated to more ethical investment ventures, which in turn compressor, a company or government to change policies. and there's a history of student activists targeting endowments during demonstrations. in the 1980s they successfully persuaded universities to divest from a pos sites south africa. and more recently, universities have divested from fossil fuels and private prisons were joining us from new york. is melanie comment? she's a professor and director of the weather head center of international affairs at harvard university. if i, if i will welcome to thanks for joining us. when it comes to these investments, the buying of stocks and shares homeless due diligence to universities across the united states. do before they spend the costs before they invest the money?

well, they usually, boards of universities, corporations or universities are in charge of establishing the general investment strategy. so they construct their investment manager or what to invest in, in broad terms or what to avoid. but most of the time, university boards outsource the management of university endowments, university funds to professional investment managers. so they're not in the weeds of exactly what is going on as, as i said, they can adopt the broad principles of what they do and do not want to invest in. but they're not necessarily deeply involved in what choices are made for specific assets to be invested in and not respect practically how easy is it then for universities to divest from israel? i mean, it's certainly possible. uh, but it's not easy in,

in the sense of turning around immediately. let's 1st of all, this is taking for, under the assumption that this is a choice that universities we're making that choice itself i think, is going to be a complicated one because of the polarizing nature of this issue in the united states. but let's say that a just that decision was adopted. it is operationally complex because it's difficult to get the micro level data to know what exactly is in the investments workers. but it's not impossible. it just would take some work and it would not be a fast turnaround decision that we've seen the success of divestment in the past, particularly when it comes to a positive south africa. what is different this time around using? yeah, so this is a much more polarizing issue at present. now let me emphasize that south africa was not a doing deal from the beginning. this is a campaign that took years and years and then making to come to fruition. so these

kinds of divestment campaigns can work, but they often don't work overnight. now the question of israel palestine is particularly polarizing in the united states. and so i think this is a very tall order. it's more complicated as well because you have a lot of congressional intervention here, as we know from us going on regarding israel and the campus drama is that are playing out right now. there's also donor interest in israel as well. donors that are major contributors to american institutions. and so, so this makes it all the more complex this issue. it's more polarizing then let's say climate change or tobacco has been these kinds of public health issues that have a guided investment in divestment decisions on university campuses. what about the potential financial in packed on places of learning universities across the us because students have potentially being expelled or simply put off wanting to study

of these kind of institutions because of the handling of all of this. so well it is, this is a really challenging issue right now in the united states. and what's, what's interesting, if you look across the landscape of universities where these protests are playing out, university administrations have adopted radically different approaches ranging from i read arrests and expulsions and so forth. as you mentioned, there are a couple of universities that have adopted a more conciliatory approach and have agreed to actually speak with protesters like, for example, brown university or northwestern university. so there's a divergence of approaches here, but there is definitely across the board, concerns about ty, batsmen and universities are very worried about rocks in their endowment values and on the returns from endowments. and so this is a major concern that they've estimate will affect the value of endowment payouts.

of course, a behind all of this is a desire to direct israel to shape its form policies that have an influence on the next decisions that it makes in regards to the war in gaza. how much do you think will divestment actually impact is there? so my sense is that financially it will have a minimal effect. but this is not necessarily about the financial ramifications of divestment. it's more about the moral ramifications. and so divestment is as much an ethical moral campaign as it is a financial campaign. and i think that's where the impact promises to be more profound. because the causes that are at the center of divestment campaigns are causes that become debates about moral and ethical issues. and so i think this is the real issue is what's the impact of the investment campaigns on public opinion around the american relationship with israel,

and particularly support for israel's military activities? all right, melanie, to come a great to have you on counting the cost. great, thank you so much. now the one goes that has led to renewed calls to boy count. it's ready products for you is palestinians of us international sanctions to be imposed in order to pressure israel to end this occupation. but for many and they don't combine. westbank is what, how strangle hold on the economy is a major obstacle for the boy called movement. the, the abraham has moved from bethlehem around the world. people are echoing palestinian calls to boy eclipse and sanction israel activists. why didn't the focus after the world garza, i don't know, targeting multinational companies, the tooth support to israel. the, the sales of mcdonalds and starbucks amongst others have declined and there's talks

took a hit, but in the occupied territory is real dominates the economy. this leads to palestinians with little to no free choice when it comes to spending their money and will call to me boy clots. he's one way of resisting these really occupation. yes. become fully boycotts because they control. i want to few and electricity, but i can inflict 55 percent losses instead of 100 percent. then i well, it's hard to measure the losses from the boy. what's campaign? what is boosted? tell us to need businesses like this to the factory. soon. these cans will make their way to jordan, where bar code of israel has been growing dramatically. this idea is real control the import and export and they often impose heavy fines in texas and overall materials. we know it's because they don't want palestinians to have factories under independent the economy. palestinians do not control the board. there's. so all exports and inputs are subjected to israel's restrictions,

bands and closures. these restrictions have for the 1st part of the city and mushroom company to shut down. it was open to challenge of these really domination of the market. a solid jazz each is a founder of the company and an activist. and the boy thought the campaign. what part that these are tries to do is break the palestinians dominate. um no punished indians. and that includes keeping them at the disadvantage uh economically uh, so to keep the economy under control to force their own economy on you product so on. but these radio for these have little control over at home made products like these. this is a local initiative to support small skid projects making had made so craft and food for many boards. the thing is where the product also gives people the opportunity to support small project. any money that does not go to israel, they say,

well instead health support a palestinian comedy, survived the difficult economy conditions that he and just the to the occupied westbank palestine. the, the, according to the well bank, $411000000000.00 is needed to rebuild ukraine. the us sent us allies, one must go to pay for its invasion. congress has passed a bill that could allow key if to use some of russia's frozen assets west, the nation's 1st $300000000000.00 in russian phone holdings. at the start of the conflict. most of that money is held in europe and financial institutions. the kremlin has now threatened to retaliate if its assets are confiscated. russia's real estate news agency says the west steps to lose assets with $288000000000.00, if it's phase and funds to seize. according to ria, the top investors in the russian economy include cyprus, remove in $98000000000.00 benevolence with $50000000000.00 the u. k,

with nearly $19000000000.00. it also reports that germany has $17000000000.00 invested fronts, $16000000.00 and easily, well, most, $13000000000.00 germany has pushed back on the plan to use frozen russian assets. it physically could set a precedent and lead to new lawsuits against the country for world war 2 crimes. but lane has paid $90000000000.00 in payments this compensation to hold a cool survivors and their families. the us roughly has $5000000.00 in russian assets and is unlikely to seize them without the agreements of the group of 7 nations out of your opinion. the issue will be discussed at the upcoming g 7 summit in italy in june. well, joining us now from brussels is to raise or follow on to she's the director of the center for russia, europe, an asian studies, and is a senior fellow of chicago council on global affairs, a very well welcome to counting the call. so the us very much covering it alone

with these measures against russia. how are they being viewed back in europe and is the you likely to follow suit? it was inside the us started. so you've been consternation about this. some legal scholars would argue that this move is unlawful, nevertheless, a good set of dangerous precedents for other u. s. allies. for example, israel from the european perspective. as you know that germany is very concerned about war, reparations that poland and greece routine lead past 4 and japan, which is part of the g 7, is also concerned how south korea would ask for war reparations. so this could just be one way of bringing russia to the negotiating table. it's difficult at this moment to know how much of it is current and how much of it is stick of cool with rush, i have several potential leave is to pull itself as well given as we mentioned in the introduction that how much your pin money is deep in to the russian economy.

one of the repercussions of russia hitching back for the year is a they have been seizing assets from various companies, and others are quietly continuing to do work in russia. so they want to preserve their already existing investments. we saw at the beginning of the war, the oil industry just pulled out and left like 25000000 on the table. so they understood that this might be a long term war, where someone middle sent companies from germany and italy is also a very deeply concerned about their enterprises. so this is a lever that can be used by russia to kind of divide and conquer european opinion on this. this will be, i imagine that there will be some sort of compromise agreement, worked out at the g 7, control sure. in any way, pushed back legally against this attempt to make the country pay for the invasion, paying for the ongoing conflict. and you can it is an unprecedented in

international law. so there are some legal questions and if we start pulling on some of the tapestry of international legal agreements, the whole thing might unravel. so russia has complained that this is a form of international piracy. and they, they really thought that by parking a lot of their assets abroad, that they wouldn't be safe. so this is also being watched very closely and carefully by being who is also trying to learn ways to, to protect their assets should of any crust. drake crisis with taiwan, blow up into conflict. you mentioned to beijing that because one of the things noticed since the start of the conflict is the direction the moscow is now looking when it to, when it comes to its investments. and the increase in export, looking very much to china, looking very much to india. i wonder what happens to global trade shirts. the wrong leave is people too soon, perhaps by the you and by the united states. i think europe is very apprehensive.

they have made it very clear. they're not going to do anything this year on this that they might consider it in 2025. so they're kind of crossing the river by feeling the stones to see how this will move. i think the us is trying to kind of pull them along by bypassing this legislation, but it's unclear what action to us will take right now. i think they are trying to pull other countries within to influence them. but there's also demands by a central eastern european leaders fearful that with the new trump administration should he, when deluxe the us selection of, that's all bets are off. so putting his gambling that trump will be re elected, and that he'll have a better outcome. so there's a time element involved in all of this as well. so i think there's a big gamble going on here and we'll see how he plays that plays it out. if he can spend this as long as possible with the europeans waiting to see how the election turns out as well. so they're not willing to stick their neck out either. but as you're, as you know, that in your early or uh, programming,

that's the most of the russian assets are parts throughout europe. so that europe really has a lot at state care. us is only about 5 to 6000000000. now there's probably close 217000 individual sanctions against russia were imposed by the us and paul and the countries. despite an exodus of hundreds of major international companies, mcdonald's ikea to name a few, the international monetary fund expects roches economy and never less to, to grow in 2024. i'm almost double that's of what the united kingdom is expected to achieve. solutions appear not to really hit the mock and most scale have a exactly, and we've seen incredible ability of russia to get around sanctions. we've seen increases, for example, 300 percent exports from conflicts done and armenia for example. so countries that companies are finding routes to get around sanctions. so this is going to be

a big issue. this also sends a positive message to beijing that proposed sanctions, or promised sanctions, should they do anything, might not really be as watertight as, as they might have expected prior to their observed experience. but russia has gone through, so there's a will, there's a way, and we've also seen a lot of, you know, russia has a oil that they've been able to exploit and the brace on way, which is actually quite dangerous for the environment. there's a lot of leakage, but they've had a lot of money coming in from that. and they're, they're backed by china. they have a lot of increased trade with china. china has been feeling back out and or questions about how much time is actually eating rushes of base for keeping up the were. and you can right to raise a file and great to have you on counting the costs. thank you. thank you. sell up or vanish from american stools. president joe biden has signed a bill that could lead to a nationwide biotech told if it's chinese or in

a bind does, doesn't divest from the app. but the deadline is in about a year's timeouts off to the 2024 election. politicians of worried tech talk may shift sensitive use that data with the chinese government. the company is always denied the allegations and says it will challenge what it cools in unconstitutional law. in cold, well, the stakes are high for take talk, losing its biggest market with a 170000000 uses. the video sharing app helps generate billions of dollars for more than $7000000.00 american businesses. that support small within $224000.00 jobs. the legal baffle could take moment, so here's to settle. meanwhile, take talk will likely still be available in the us, in the band take talk in 2021. other countries including britain, australia, kind of the funds have bolted on official devices. we'll discuss sort of this, jody me now from belin is frederica castillo. you know, she is a tech policy expert of i will welcome to you. so let me start by asking you,

this was the us. what is the us rights about? it's fee is around to take talk is parent company, but does i think the fears are correct? the response raises some really serious questions and consider that precedent. so they're basically 2 main concerns about tick tock. the 1st one is like any other social media app, take talk class, connect vast amounts of data. and the fear is that because the chinese government has a lot of influence over companies, territory like by dance, the theories that the chinese government could access data and over a 170000000 us americans. so that's the privacy issue. the 2nd series about manifestation in the election into parents take service on popular because of the algorithm is really good at recommending content. it's very hard to see from the out send how and why content is recommended and how content is being moderated. again, the american fear here is that this means that the app could be influenced by the

chinese government to spread misinformation for censorship and to influence the election. so those are the concerns. however, there are many things to us government could do. instead of bending the app wholesale, if the button does go into for us, it won't be for at least 9 months time. and the assumption is that there may well be some illegal pushback from take talk. and his parent company by don says, well, it does pay the question that for this, this purely a political move, especially as want to former us president donald trump seemed keen on binding take talk to don't think this is a purely political move. it seems to be a bipartisan support or bi partisan concern about tip top drum tried to ban the trump tried to ban the up and he was in office. it failed to do a legal challenge. now this is the 2nd attempt at banding, the app we will expect legal challenges coming from takes up who claim that a band violates the 1st amendment. so i don't think it's in

a cold there real concerns. it's still a very bold move to just the band and, and tie up when the united states, for instance, could implement a comprehensive data privacy law that currently doesn't exist. the us could implement a platform law or the platform regulations, such as the european union has that would force all social media apps including take talk to be much, much more transparent about how they operate. microsoft, oracle even need lots of being flying because potential buyers of take talk. how to go about buying a company like this. how much does it even cost? i think 1st of all, the question is would buy, tends even one to sell take talk. so the chinese government passed the law, that means the government has to agree to any purchase of critical technology and take talk and it's algorithm have been deemed critical. so the 1st question is, with the chinese government even a breed to a style of tech. so the 2nd one is the price tag, a tick tock of us is take talks,

largest market. i already set 170000000 use us. last year, the financial times reported 60000000000 in sale. they are very few american companies that couldn't even afford a purchase of, of an athletic talk given the number of uses in the united states. and indeed the globally, those big the question, what sort of impact of bond on take salt. but i would have on small businesses, for instance, but use take talk is a really important marketing tool. for instance. what we've seen from other countries in india has been to talk a few years ago. we've seen that a small businesses influence has moved on to other platforms. not all people have a large following on take talk have the same following, let's say on instagram, on other apps. so there's a question whether some people lose out in this move, but we've generally seen a cheaper shift to other apps. one and outcome sense. is there any scope, you know, so would, is there any scope here,

sorry to interrupt for china to potentially retaliate? if uh, this bond goes ahead, a lot of china, a lot of american apps already banned in china. i think it's definitely not a positive step towards good us, chinese relationships. okay, frederica, come figured out great to have you on counsel the costs money. thanks. i thank you . well, that's our show for this week. get in touch with us on x, fully known as switzer needs baka, and to use the hash tag h a c t c. when you do or drop us an e mail account and the cost of that, which is here at dot net is our address. but there's more for you online that i'll just here a don't. com slash c t c. cancel the cost. that will take you straight to our page, which has individual reports, links and into episode speaking, to catch up soon for this edition of comments in the call. so i'm deep pockets on the whole team. thanks for joining us and use this next. you know,

and i'll just say the hard hitting intervenes as the i r c suffered casualties. we have not suffered to say, tyler sees thank goodness we did have injuries from a missile strike on a guest house. thought provoking on to who they to say no double stand to all of us any, any one in particular. i said, all facing realities government seems here to whittle down democracy. if this is troubling for you. it's very, very painful here. the story on talk to how does era, the latest news as it breaks criminal and start fighting for access to the river. it leads to which this countries in major ports, and that's where drugs are traffic out of the country with in depth reports ukraine, struggling to find men to fight in some sections of the front line. brushing forces out number,

it's 7 to one from the heart of the story. this is the flight channel of a dumb full of the water in it flowing in see the kind of a box which has already passed inside. and i care about helping us engages with the rest of the world. we're really interested in taking you in to a place you might not visit otherwise. i feel as if you were there. this is the 1st genocide that we see in feel. there's a disconnect between what we are witnessing on social media versus what we're seeing on mainstream in the listening post covers have in use is cut off for a 10 year journey in which it has become the most important translation award from i'm into the how to rubik language, world wide shaped come out award for translation and international understanding. unknown. see is the opening of the nomination period for the year 2024 starting march 1st to may. 30 fast nominations are made on the award official website, w, w,

w dot h t a dot q a forward slash e m. the arc will be placed under arrest. us please clack, down on students, solidarity encampments and support the palestinians. but protest as move demonstrations into the street, the elements of a problem and this is all just a lie, some doha also coming on the students and you.